Okay, I'll Bite: Malkin to the Kings?
Kukla's Korner ("Move Malkin?") gets the ball rolling by citing two articles ruminating on Evgeni Malkin's future in Pittsburgh. I guess the idea is that Pittsburgh needs to make some changes in order to be a perenniel cup contender instead of whatever they are (the article calls them potentially "one and done" but I don't see that at all; grass/greener etc.). The first is from the Penguins' home paper:
ANALYSIS: How to win it all next season - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review
Field offers for Malkin
Crosby and Malkin will be more dominant with a young, skilled wing to grow with. However, given the cap constraints, the only way to land that wing is to move one of them for a package that would upgrade the roster and replenish a system that lacks impact forwards beyond top prospect Eric Tangradi. Staal's development as a Selke Trophy candidate for his defensive work and offensive upside -- at 21, he has produced three 20-goal seasons as a third-liner -- gives the Penguins the option of trading Crosby or Malkin. Staal is a prototype No. 2 center and an emerging dressing-room leader. The Penguins won't trade Crosby, who aside from being team captain is the franchise's face. Malkin, already a scoring champion and playoff MVP at 23, is the guy to shop. Shero should start making calls to his contemporaries, and his first words should be: "Make me an offer for Malkin." It must include a top-line wing, a top-pairing defenseman, two roster players and either two top prospects or two first-round picks. To give up Geno, the Penguins must get the world in return. If they get it, their Cup window won't be limited to three seasons, as it will be with the three-center plan.
So what does that mean to the Kings? A top-line wing (Alexander Frolov, Justin Williams, Ryan Smyth or Dustin Brown -- except Frolov isn't signed, Smyth is too old and Williams is broken into a million pieces -- so, that leaves Brown), a top-pairing defenseman (Rob Scuderi, Drew Doughty, Jack Johnson...that means Johnson), two additional (?) roster players (okay, how about Davis Drewiske and Peter Harrold -- ha ha -- seriously, Drewiske and Stoll) and two top prospects (nah) or two first round picks (uhhhh, maybe not, but I'll play along).
Brown, Johnson, Stoll, Drewiske and 2010 and 2011 1st round picks for Malkin. And in return we get...
Well, for starters, our 2nd line (or 1st line?) center problem would be solved. But we would have some, uh, holes to fill. Yeah, I think I would pass on that deal. Would Lombardi prefer to sign that UFA Russian guy whose name escapes me and who has scored more goals than anyone since 2002, or else maybe that other fellow with the constipated expression frozen on his face who can also play center and whom Deano drafted? I think so. I don't think Lombardi would be willing to part with Brown or Johnson.
But let's look at what the Edmonton Journal is thinking on the same topic:
Malkin, who has four years left on his contract, is hardly excess baggage, but if Shero were to pick up the phone and start canvassing his lodge-brothers he might get what he sorely needs -- two top-six forwards. If he could get two wingers who make about $8 million total that would be less than Malkin's $8.7-million cap hit, and maybe a team would throw in a stocking stuffer, too. A good draft pick or a top-nine, young-20s forward. [...] The Penguins have nobody on the wing who really scares the opposition. [...] I say the Oilers should make a few calls. They've got Ales Hemsky and Dustin Penner, who take up a $8.325-million cap hit this upcoming season and the year after. They could give them Andrew Cogliano as well. OK, none of those players is as good as Malkin, 23, who has 381 points in 309 NHL games. I know that. But Hemsky, 26, and Penner, 27, are in the prime of their careers, and are certainly top-six forwards. And the Penguins need top-flight wingers, in the worst way.
So the Edmonton arm-chair GM is offering Ales Hemsky, Dustin Penner and Andrew Cogliano. What's the Kings' equivalent of that? I guess it's Justin Williams, Jarret Stoll and Dustin Brown. Is that better than the first fake trade? I don't know. I guess so, since it's kind of Williams-in and Johnson-out.
If the Kings were to do the Edmonton Journal version, you would have:
(Frolov)/Malkin/Loktionov
Yes, that's not bad. I have been trading Stoll and Williams in my mind for awhile anyway. Brown? Painful. But. I don't know. I think not. How about this as a counter-offer?
Stoll, Williams, Thomas Hickey and Colten Teubert for Malkin.
Oh how that hurts even to think. I can't believe I typed it. But I think Pitt might actually do it. They already have the captain of one Team Canada, and they could add to that the WJC captain and alt. captain, two incredibly highly regarded blue-chip prospects. Stoll would excel in a true third line center role, and Williams can try not to get hurt so he can score forty goals next to Sidney Crosby.
Maybe I'm dreaming that Pitt would take Williams. I think they would leap at the same deal with Brown instead of Williams, but I think I would balk at that. So what would we look like without Stoll and Williams but keeping Brown (sorry, it's my post, I'm sending Williams to Pitt).
Loktionov/Malkin/Brown
Scuderi/Doughty
Johnson/Volchenkov*
O'Donnell
*did I mention I signed Volchenkov as a UFA?
Again, top six center problem solved. Second unit better than first unit, but we won't tell anyone. Before you freak out about Schenn not only playing wing but playing on the wrong side, what I'm imagining is what Murray did with Moller and Handzus before Oscar left for the WJC last season; Moller played offensive zone center but swapped with Handzus for the defensive zone responsibilities. I thought it was brilliant at the time. And this way Handzus can mentor Schenn the way he mentored Simmonds. I'm upset about losing Hickey and Teubert, but otherwise happy. I think Loktionov/Malkin/Brown would out-score whoever/Stoll/Brown by about forty goals. Also, Malkin is mean. Really, I don't see how the Kings would lose even a single game next year.
(I make joke)
I'm sure he'll end up in Anaheim or San Jose.
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Well, Kovalchuk doesn't cost us any players
but will affect the cap down the road (when it’s time to sign Doughty, etc., it will get tight)
Kovalchuk is unproven in the post-season, as they say, and doesn’t really play defense.
Malkin is big and mean, which is a plus. But we would be sending millionaires the other way. Some favorite players would be lost.
Marleau is another one in the conversation. I prefer him to Kovalchuk. Better leader, maybe, more responsible defensively.
And then there’s Iginla.
I guess if I had my pick, I would cross off Kovalchuk and prioritize the other three based what we would have to give up. Snagging Marleau is probably the safest move.
Wait till this year.
Kovalchuk's a winger, though; he's more one-dimensional than Malkin
Obviously, what you get from a centreman is a lot different than what you get from a winger. Given that you’ve got Kopitar in place already, it might be a good idea to get an elite winger to play with him, but having a one-two punch like Kopitar and Malkin down the middle would be amazing; you’d be neck-and-neck with Pittsburgh for the best top-two centres in the league, in my opinion.
Must be nice to have that kind of flexibility, though…
by Peter Raaymakers on May 17, 2010 8:06 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, kind of a side-point to the topic, but I wonder who are the teams with the most interest in all four of those players are going to be, you know, how many teams could realistically even afford to put an offer on the table to Kovalchuk. The Kings obviously have a lot to offer in a trade and cap space, and I can’t help but wonder and get excited for when July 1st comes around: it’s going to be like Christmas.
I know your offer for Malkin is just a hypothetical, but giving up Hickey and Tuebert, yikes. I think it’s likely we do have enough prospects on defense to afford a trade like that, and if it were going to happen, I would hope for it be for a player of Malkin’s caliber. It’s hard to say, but hopefully that’s the final “piece” to the boxes for Dean Lombardi’s concern, and then there won’t be much left to do other than develop.
Volchenkov? I’d rather we sign Dan Hamhuis… And I know Kovy and Marleau has been talked about a lot, but what about Ponikarovsky?
Everyone needs to believe in something. I believe I'll have another beer.
Volchenkov because we need a very solid stay at home D guy to play with Johnson who would be the puck mover and offensive Dman in that pairing. Volchenkov can play big minutes and is a warrior that blocks shots and just plays excellent shut down defense and hopefully can help mentor JJ on the defensive side of his game
Ditto on Volchenkov…38 PIM’s in 64 games, a -2 (on Ottawa) and average ice time of 22:30. Defensive stud…
Why do I think Volchenkov will sign for a cap hit of less than $5MM?
In the 4s somewhere.
Wait till this year.
If it’s $4M, I think Ottawa will keep him. But Detroit and Washington, by all accounts, are going to drive up that price tag to an unreasonably high number. At least that’s the impression I get, as an Ottawa fan.
by Peter Raaymakers on May 17, 2010 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions
I was thinking more like $4.5-4.75MM, but you're right about DET and WAS
I don’t think it will go unreasonably high. Not for a shut-down defenseman. I sort of think WAS will be looking for a goalie first, but what do I know?
Wait till this year.
I agree
I don’t think it will go unreasonably high because if a team goes who do we want to overpay to get: a 40-50(or more) goal scorer in Marleau or Kovalchuk or a defensive stud that maybe will get 2 goals this season in Volchenkov? Forwards and point producers are more likely to be overpayed than a solid defensive guy in my opinion. That’s not to say that he wont have his price driven up and be overpaid, just that I think it will be less than what we have seen the past few years with some forwards.
You’ve got to consider the circumstances, though: What does a team who already has Ovechkin, Semin, and now Backstrom signed want to overpay for? Probably a defenceman. Given the emergence of Neuvirth and Varlamov as reasonably reliable goaltenders given a decent defence corps in front of them, I think Washington is going to look for defensive help this off-season.
And although Detroit certainly needs help up front, they probably need it in the form of an infusion of youth. And if Nicklas Lidstrom retires, well, they’ll need to find someone to play defence; Volch is a very different player, but by moving some pieces around they could try to internally replace Lidstrom (or at least partially off-set that void) while using Volchenkov as a defensive failsafe.
But hey, who knows. I’m still hoping he stays in Ottawa for $17.5M over five years, but I’m not counting on it.
by Peter Raaymakers on May 17, 2010 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Just say No
…to Ponikarovsky. Bring in Marleau…
and on the 93rd postseason of the National Hockey League, the Slovakian-hockeygod Zeus commanded from high atop Mount Figueroa..."RELEASE THE MEAT TRAIN!" And it was good.
by DodgerBlueBalls on May 17, 2010 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions
An interesting atricle that I ran across
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/392454-5-superstars-who-could-be-traded-this-off-season
I know it’s bleacher report so it is just some random guy but still he thinks Malkin could go for a 1st line winger and a prospect/pick. I think it would take more than that personally but if we offered Stoll(to replace C need), Brown/Williams(a top winger to play with Crosby, and a prospect(Hickey/Teubert/Voynov I would just pick one of the Dmen we have to send) and something like a 2nd or 3rd round pick then Shero would have to listen because it also clears up some cap space issues they may have.
Smyth-Kopitar-Simmonds
Frolov-Malkin-Loktionov (the all russian line if we re-sign Fro for a small raise like 3.5)
Schenn-Handzus-Modin(if modin signs for cheap like O’donnel this year)
Clifford-Richardson-Parse
Doughty-Scuderi
Johnson-Volchenkov
Greene-Voynov
Quick/Bernier
That would be one hell of a lineup if we could make it happen. Actually now I realize that is giving up Brown,WIlliams, and Stoll so maybe Brown takes modin’s place. I haven’t really taken into account the cap and im sure this would be pushing it so maybe Volchenkov would have to be a cheaper defensive minded Dman or something but still that gives us two very good scoring lines, one heck of a checking line that can also score quite a bit and a very good young energy line with solid D pairs all the way through and two terrific young goalies.
Quisp you have to stop with all these trade ideas you are getting me too excited about the offseason after playoffs when trades/draft/free agency start.
In the end I think this will be like a few years ago when there were rumors about Malkin being traded to avoid RFA issue or Ovechkin if caps didnt want to give him max money and then they both end up re-signing because they are too good to let go and everyone got excited for nothing.
Of course the chances of Malkin going anywhere at all aren't great
and of landing in LA, even less so. At least the Kings are in a place now where it’s realistic to put them in the conversation.
Wait till this year.
Hahahaha... you're picking up Volchenkov, too?
Well, he’ll cost you about $5M that you might be better off putting towards your forward shopping list, but he’d be a heck of a pickup. The only problem, though, is I don’t think you can play him with an offensive guy like Johnson (Johnson is an offensive guy, right?). He’s got o be on a shutdown pairing along with another defensive guy to be his best.
Although he seems to think he’s got more to offer offensively; maybe what you propose, along with some PP time, might be just what the doctor ordered to turn him into a Norris candidate.
by Peter Raaymakers on May 17, 2010 8:08 AM PDT reply actions
My feeling is that we need to bring in a top-4 defenseman before we bring in a top-six forward
UFA, I mean.
We can have both (a top-six forward and a top-four defenseman) however because we have Stoll and Williams to trade by the time Schenn is ready, which might be just a few months away. I think you can deal Stoll and Williams (or a similar package, plus picks and prospects) to get one top-line winger (which would presumably be an even trade in terms of cap space), and then sign a defenseman, or vice versa (trade for d, sign forward).
Wait till this year.
I love Trevor Lewis, don't get me wrong
I think he has the potential to be Handzus after Handzus, or something. I just don’t know when he’s going to bust out. I can’t really justify putting him above Parse, and he (Lewis) hasn’t yet had one of those seasons where you “take notice.” He doesn’t have to do that, but it helps, right? He’s an RFA this summer — as are Elkins, Clune, Cliche and Parse — so we’ll get a better idea what Lombardi thinks of all those guys this summer. Interesting, since those are exactly the guys he’s battling for a spot.
Wait till this year.
by Quisp on May 17, 2010 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Lewis hasn't busted out in the Show yet because he was on a line with the Rat and Peter Harrold
not even Crosby would put up points playing on a line with those guys.
Lewis’ can only score 20 goals in a season while playing in the AHL. I don’t expect we will succeed in the NHL based on what he’s shown us thus far.
and on the 93rd postseason of the National Hockey League, the Slovakian-hockeygod Zeus commanded from high atop Mount Figueroa..."RELEASE THE MEAT TRAIN!" And it was good.
by DodgerBlueBalls on May 17, 2010 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions
- “he will succeed"
and on the 93rd postseason of the National Hockey League, the Slovakian-hockeygod Zeus commanded from high atop Mount Figueroa..."RELEASE THE MEAT TRAIN!" And it was good.
by DodgerBlueBalls on May 17, 2010 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions
True, but to be fair, Lewis has a pretty well-rounded game
(and he was injured most of this year)
he plays both sides of the puck, he’s smart, he’s fast (at least, i remember him being fast). i don’t think he’s going to fail to have an NHL career, though he may end up somewhere else.
Wait till this year.
I keep hearing from others that Lewis will make an excellent defensive forward someday in the NHL
However, if that is the case, then shouldn’t Trevor have a +/- rating better than -15 over his 182 game American Hockey League career?
and on the 93rd postseason of the National Hockey League, the Slovakian-hockeygod Zeus commanded from high atop Mount Figueroa..."RELEASE THE MEAT TRAIN!" And it was good.
by DodgerBlueBalls on May 17, 2010 2:52 PM PDT up reply actions
presumably the "system" is a little funky down there
but yeah, this is a good point.
Wait till this year.
Somehow most of the speculation includes Frolov on the Kings...
I thought the consensus was that he would demand a raise that would price him out. Personally, I would give him 4.25 tops, but for that money you can get a faster player with a different skill set. I would love to see him stay, but I just doubt it. Still Malkin would use up all the space, I would still much rather get two guys for 3 mill and develop a speed line to complement the Kopi possession type line.
End Corporate Personhood.
Stay away from my Malkin. We’re not trading him =p
Going to have around 11M in cap space, and after bringing up 2-3 good prospects(9.5M caps space after), only a few spots are left to fill. That still means we can get 4 more solid starting players, a 2-3M winger, and a 2-3M shutdown D player. The Pens are in great shape this offseason, and everyone that underachieved is out of a contract. I would say there is about a .5% chance Malkin is even considered being traded. The Pens are already in a rebuilding year, trading Malkin for half a team would just put us in nearly the same position without a top 5 player.











