Irrational Non-Binding Kings Roster Musings
by Quisp on Jul 23, 2010 12:00 AM PDT
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PrintAbout six weeks till rookie camp! Hardly seems possible. Time to forget about old you-know-who and get on with the business of dreaming up this year's rosters for our various teams. First, we'll look at the current roster players, identify holes, then we'll look at who can fill those holes, internally and externally. Then we'll look at the prospects, to see who is likely to be ready. And then (last?) we'll look at trade scenarios, who might be on the block, who might be attainable via trade.
Kings Roster as of 7/22/2010
Ryan Smyth - Anze Kopitar - Justin Williams
LW2 - Jarret Stoll - Dustin Brown
Scott Parse - Michal Handzus - Wayne Simmonds
LW4 - (Brad Richardson) - RW4
F13, Peter Harrold
Jack Johnson - D4
D5 - Matt Greene
The open spots are:
- top-six left wing
- two bottom six forwards (ideally physical ones, could be one banger and one defensive forward, e.g. Eric Belanger, or maybe an "energy" guy)
- a second pairing defenseman (ideally someone "stay at home" to ground JJ)
- a third pairing defenseman (or a 7th defenseman, if Drewiske is ready to take the third pairing spot with Greene) and
- maybe a 14th forward for the press box (could be an enforcer).
Prospects Who Might be Ready to Fill Some of Those Spots:
Top six left wing -- Brayden Schenn (yes, I know he's a center)
Bottom six forward (physical): Kyle Clifford, Jordan Nolan, Kevin Westgarth.
Bottom six forward (defensive Belanger type): Trevor Lewis, Marc-Andre Cliche
Bottom six forward (energy): Rich Clune
2nd pairing defenseman (stay-at-home): n/a
3rd pairing defenseman: Jacob Muzzin
Prospects who might be ready but there's no obvious place for them: Thomas Hickey, Viatcheslav Voynov, Johan Fransson, Ray Kaunisto, Oscar Moller, Andrei Loktionov, Corey Elkins, Alec Martinez, Bud Holloway.
I also believe that Ersberg will be dealt and Jonathan Bernier and Jonathan Quick will be the goalies, but there's no obvious place to say that. So I'll just say it here.
What I Think Lombardi Thinks
- Clifford is likely ready to play a bottom-six role. Lewis might be ready. Kaunisto? (I don't know about Lombardi, but I thought he looked solid in what I saw of the development camp; I can picture him challenging Lewis, but what do I know). Clune will play, unless he hurts himself. So that's Clifford, Lewis/Kaunisto, Clune, Richardson, maybe factor in Moller, who can play an "energy" role sort of. Therefore, no need to bring in anyone via trade or UFA signing for the bottom six. Although...
- Maaaaybe he'll sign someone like Fredrik Modin (at discount) or Eric Belanger to keep the bottom six from being too green.
- Schenn might be able to take the third line LW spot from Parse, but he's probably not going to be able to step into a top-six spot. Not saying he won't. But he probably won't.
- LW2 (or LW1, depending on how you look at it) needs to be filled either by UFA signing or via trade.
- The second pairing defenseman slot could have been filled by Volchenkov et al, but that ship has sailed. No-one in the depth chart (maaaaaybe) Muzzin fits the job description of "stay-at-home", but it's possible to change the concept of that pairing and turn it into a dynamite offensive d-pair, in which case Hickey, Voynov, Fransson and Martinez are contenders. Still, the option of trading for a top-four defenseman might be the best move, depending on what happens re LW2.
- Muzzin, Fransson, Hickey and Voynov can fight it out for the last D spot. I (Quisp) give the edge to Muzzin and Fransson.
So, after mulling over the prospects, the roster looks like this:
Smyth - Kopitar - Williams
LW2 - Stoll - Brown
Parse/Schenn - Handzus - Simmonds
Clifford - Richardson - Clune/Lewis
Westgarth, Harrold
Scuderi - Doughty
Johnson - D4
Muzzin/Fransson - Greene
Drewiske
Quick - Bernier
With the open spots being top-six left wing and second pairing defenseman. How, oh how, can we fill those spots?
What Free Agents Are Available?
Top six forward: Well, there's this Ilya Kovalchuk guy. Also, Alexander Frolov and Alexei Ponikarovsky.
Second pairing defenseman: Willie Mitchell, Andreas Lilja (I know both these guys have issues, but play along).
Who Might Be Available via Trade?
Top six forward: Simon Gagne, Patrick Sharp (yes, I know what Bowman said), Bobby Ryan (I said trade, not offer sheet, calm down!), Marc Savard, Michael Ryder. Also, our friend Lou may need some help moving salary, so there are some options there where we wouldn't have to give anything up. Dainus Zubrus, Travis Zajac, I don't know. Not that exciting. I'm not mentioning Parise because they won't move him.
Second pairing defenseman: Tomas Kaberle, Sheldon Souray, Brian Campbell, Kevin Bieksa.
Who do I think Lombardi likes from this group? Gagne, Sharp, Ryan and Bieksa. And of the free agents: Kovalchuk or Frolov (at the right price), Ponikavovsky, maybe. Mitchell and Lilja (in both cases, if healthy-ish).
If I could pick anyone from this list: (in order) Kovalchuk, Ryan, Sharp, Frolov, Ponikarovsky; healthy Mitchell, Bieksa, Lilja.
Decision Tree
If Kovalchuk is signable at a doable cap hit, Lombardi does it and calls it a day.If Kovalchuk doesn't work out,does Lombardi go for plan B Frolov, or promote a prospect that probably is not ready (Schenn, Moller, Parse, Loktionov, Holloway, etc.), or make a trade? We'll start with the trade option:Gagne is a Lombardi "type." He's available and PHI needs to dump salary. So in all likelihood, it would be a prospect and pick and maybe a cheap roster player for Gagne kind of deal.A deal for Sharp would be in the same vein.Gagne obviously has injury issues, as has been discussed ad nauseum. Just the fact that Philly fans would be crushed (since they love him) and Kings fans would be mad (because it's another example of Lombardi's love of wounded character guys) makes it an interesting option.And Sharp doesn't suck either. Neither is an especially great move(when you've been spending weeks contemplating Kovalchuk),but could be a very good one, if the chips fall just so. There is a splashy trade option, though, and that's- Bobby Ryan. I don't understand why Ryan is not taking the money from Anaheim. And I can't imagine what hefty price Anaheim would demand in exchange for him, if they would even be willing to trade to their hated cross-town rivals at all. But I would gladly send Williams, Stoll and a package of prospects and picks to Anaheim for Ryan. But I probably wouldn't want to let go of the prospects it would take to get that done. Anyway, I don't think it will happen in a million years. Which is what I say when I want somethiing to happen but want to sound not batshit crazy.
- So then the question becomes, it is better to give up prospects for
Gagne orSharp, or give up no one and re-sign Frolov? If Frolov can be had for less than $4MM, I would go with the Fro. If not, I guess I would look at Ponikarovsky, who I still think has the potential to dominate. If that doesn't work, try for Sharpor Gagne. Unless the price is too steep, in which case, stand pat and wait for a better deal to emerge, while allowing Loktionov, Schenn, Moller, Holloway, et al, duke it out for the spot. - As far as defensemen, I would simultaneously look into Mitchell and Lilja while finding out what the price for Bieksa would be. If Lombardi thinks Simmonds and Schenn are ready for top-six duty, I could see something like Justin Williams or Jarret Stoll for Bieksa, with picks and prospects balancing it out. But are Simmonds and Schenn ready? Simmonds, maybe. Schenn, maybe not yet. If I knew that Mitchell was healthy, I would probably lean heavily in his direction, but that's hard to know, and impossible to guarantee. My hunch is that the second-pairing d-man is not going to be cast immediately. There is no outstanding no-brainer option, just several options that could be great or could be less great.
All of which suggests something like this:
Smyth - Kopitar - Simmonds
Ponikarovsky/Frolov - Stoll - Brown
Schenn - Handzus - Clifford*
Parse - Richardson - Moller
Clune/Westgarth, Harrold
Scuderi - Doughty
Johnson - Bieksa
Muzzin/Fransson - Greene
Drewiske
Quick - Bernier
*Yes, I know. He's a left wing.
Looking at that line-up, I do not like the Fro/Poni left side. Oh maybe I do. I don't know. But let's say I don't. Because I also want to bring up the notion of trading for the rights to Bill Sweatt from Toronto, who has announced they are letting him go. They have his rights until 8/15, then he's UFA. I would throw a pick their way and grab him early. You can never have too many faster-than-the-speed-of-light guys. And maybe he makes the team. And then I live my dream of having a "speed" unit, like the old Donnelly/Millen line, and it looks like this:
Smyth - Kopitar - Simmonds
Sweatt - Loktionov - Moller
Clifford - Schenn - Brown
Parse - Handzus - Richardson
Clune, Westgarth
Scuderi - Doughty
Johnson - Bieksa
Muzzin/Fransson - Greene
Drewiske
Quick - Bernier
Okay, that has many problems. For one thing, it's a great line-up for the year after next, but I don't think Loktionov (especially) or Moller will be ready for top-six duty this year. It's a physical maturity thing. Otherwise, that's a powerful line. And the Clifford/Schenn/Brown line is great too, but also a year from being ready for prime time. That one is closer than the Lokti/Moller line. But still, not quite.
Another problem is I got rid of Stoll (as well as Williams) and didn't get anything back. Yeah, this is a good line-up for 2011-12. Not for this year.
Retooling. Keeping Sweatt. Keeping Bieksa. Bring back Stoll. Signing Modin for cheap. Drop Loktionov and Moller to the AHL, dammit.
Smyth - Kopitar - Simmonds
Sweatt - Stoll - Brown
Schenn - Handzus - Clifford
Parse - Richardson - Modin
Clune, Westgarth
Scuderi - Doughty
Johnson - Bieksa
Muzzin/Fransson - Greene
Drewiske
Quick - Bernier
Five rookies (Schenn, Clifford, Sweatt, Muzzin or Fransson, and Bernier). That's too much. But I think three of those guys (Muzzin or Fransson, Clifford, Bernier) will make it. Schenn and (especially!) Sweatt are iffy. But so what? That would be a team I would pay to see play every night.
So I'm going to leave it in the spirit of blog whimsy and let you pick me apart.
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Comments
If you want a lightning fast guy. Why not look to Edmonton for Andrew Cogliano whose already proven he can play in the NHL? Edmonton’s been shopping him.. Don’t know what price would be though. he’s young and very fast and could possibly be a top 6 forward?
I believe the price for Cogliano is 1/3 of Dany Heatley.
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions
In counting all the rookies, I wouldn’t really include Bernier because yeah he is a rookie, but goalies are kinda counted differently when it comes to experience than skaters. No one really goes well that goalie is a rookie so he’s going to struggle and be immature and make bad decisions. Pretty much his decisions involve stopping the puck not making an ill advised pass or w/e like a rookie skater would have to deal with.
Still maybe too many rookies so drop one more maybe and make it 3 out of Schenn, Clifford, Muzzin, Fransson, and Sweatt(if we even get him). I think that’s reasonable with Schenn and Clifford likely making the team and at least one young defenseman with the other coming through free agency or trade.
DL seems higher on Schenn than you :)
He told Gladys Kravitz that Schenn would have a shot at 2nd line C.
I would not be averse to Mitchell at a price that reduces the risk of taking him on, say, $3 mil or less.
by DougX on Jul 23, 2010 12:53 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
Also I'm a little surprised you even considered Campbell
The Kings don’t have any Preissing-like junk contracts left to make it worthwhile to trade for him.
by DougX on Jul 23, 2010 1:00 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
I don't think forwards are the biggest problem
I’d say D men are. I have no idea what to do about that problem. No one out there really fits our needs. I think Muzzin is our best shot, prospect wise. He did show some composure at the prospect camp and also for the Monarchs when they brought him in. This might sound crazy, but I think we could get by with DD, JJ, Scuds, Green, Drewiski and Muzzin, with Harrold as a backup until the right top four player becomes available, if the goaltending is good, which it damned well should be with Quick and Bernier.
As far as forward go, I loved both Schenn and Clifford last training camp, and they both play really hard every shift. My gut feeling about Schenn is that he will rise to the challenge if given the chance, and he’s made his contract workable so that TM can start him on the lower lines and move him up if he is performing.
Clifford, to me, is like Simmonds with less offensive talent but more enforcer/agitator qualities. I love this guy. I’d love to see him on the Zeus line because I think it would really bring out the best in him, as it did for Simmer.
In the short term, I like Modin for the bottom 6. He lived up to his part of the deal last season, and proved that he is a veteran in the playoffs.
My gut feeling about Schenn is that he will rise to the challenge if given the chance, and he’s made his contract workable so that TM can start him on the lower lines and move him up if he is performing.
This is also what I’m hoping for. Thanks to his bonuses, we could ease him into it.
Clifford, to me, is like Simmonds with less offensive talent but more enforcer/agitator qualities. I love this guy. I’d love to see him on the Zeus line because I think it would really bring out the best in him, as it did for Simmer.
Ooooh.
In Dinglebarn We Trust
Fransson and Muzzin also could both make it.
Fransson is not a kid, and he’s also a former high second-rnd pick (34th/Dallas, 2004). The Dallas blog people are very high on him, as well as some other blog folks for other teams who hoped their teams would be able to grab him. One very smart guy said he thinks Fransson is “this year’s Hjalmarsson.” Obviously, we should be so lucky.
Anyway, although I wasn’t gutsy enough to fully predict it, I do think it’s possible we’ll see some version of
Scuderi Doughty
Johnson Muzzin
Fransson Greene
Drewiske
but i do think it’s highly likely we’ll see someone like Mitchell or Bieksa, or Lilja also.
My number one concern is not the defense, nor is it really any one position per se. It’s the fact that a number of prospects could actually be ready this year, and you can’t just promote them all, even if you have space. You have to have some veterans peppered in, more than what we would have if there is no UFA/trade-acquired d man and no crusty vet forward added to balance things out.
Wait till this year.
Not in a great mood right now, down on Lombardi
for squandering the few potential signings of free agents while playing wack-a-Kovi. We needed Hamhuis, but I guess conventional wisdom is that he got overpaid. Frankly, it looks like Dean says, on the one hand, that we can spend 6.5 or whatever on Kovi, but when it comes ot other players like Hamhuis then we “have to be very careful” and suddenly 4 million is too much.
He says the core “isn’t going anywhere” and that he is working to keep them through new contracts. Fine. But at some point you have to have veterans that know the league, know the physical toll that comes late season and can prepare for it, and are able to withstand the “grind” mentally. In short, I mean adults.
I would be happy with Belanger, even though it would appear to make Stoll expendable. For me, Stoll does much more than just take face-offs; even without his quarterbacking the power play, which I had hoped to improve on, I like him for this team. Having Belanger would take some of the load off Stoll, who is a gamer and seemed to get worn out. I felt he was over-used, too much was expected of him, and then he got bounced around for lack of production.
My fear with so many youngsters is that Murray will consequently lean on the veterans too much, as he did with Quick last year. (I know Quick wasn’t a “veteran”, but the point holds) The team was tired looking in the last weeks and playoffs. And of course, there is the extra travel the Kings must do, it’s a simple geographical fact. That is why the combination of youngsters and Murray scare me. He can bring guys along, but he has to win, and he would end up not being able or else not being willing to roll 4 lines, and by late March we are back to Kings hockey; close but no cigar.
Ryan? Doubt it, too expensive in prospects, but would love to have him. Mitchell could be a problem because we have no enforcer, and putting his concussions out there to fight is very risky. Bieksa is an asshole, maybe we need him, but not sure how he would fit in the locker room. Curious about his character, I just don’t know. Campbell doesn’t fit the Lombardi thrift store window display. Patrick Sharp would be a great pickup, but he is much like Stoll; QB on PP, faceoffs, more expensive and better scoring but also less consistent defensively night in and night out. I am all for stocking up on utility guys, but I fear if we got Sharp then Lombardi would think we don’t need Stoll, and we would be almost break-even having lost whatever we had to give up to get Sharp in the first place. Souray I dunno about, I hear he has a cannon from the point but can be slow of foot and mind.
Dammit I wanted Saku Koivu, Dan Hamhuis, and any of the Chicago seven. Now it’s down to a 19 year old Schennn, or some Canuck I have always hated. Bleck. Hopefully, the other D-men you mentioned in our system can drink some MiracleGro.
I totally agree on having a speed line; I had proposed Koivu to center it.
Bottom line, at this point, is that Lombardi seems to be where you are; we look good for 2011-2012. Like that 70’s vultures poster said, “Patience my ass, I am gonna kill something!” That’s how I feel. I wish Lombardi would use some of his prospects to trade for two freaking veterans, and sign Frolov at 4.25. Ice a team that can win for the whole season and still have something left for the playoffs.
End Corporate Personhood.
I think Stoll's days are numbered
if I had to predict, Williams and Stoll are moved this year, and Handzus is re-signed at a discount. As soon as Schenn is ready, Stoll has to go. We don’t need $3-4MM bottom six players. Handzus has been worth it only because he’s the center of our entire defensive existence, overstating for emphasis.
Belanger as an affordable and no less reliable replacement for Stoll makes sense. however, lewis and cliche have shots at being the new belanger, so that’s worth watching.
Wait till this year.
Amen.
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions
Anyway, I don’t think it will happen in a million years. Which is what I say when I want somethiing to happen but want to sound not batshit crazy.
Yeah. I feel like this about James Neal. I can’t imagine Dallas, Anaheim, or Chicago wanting to deal with any playoff teams in the West.
Sweatt’s expectations seem odd. I honestly don’t know why he’d be difficult for Chicago and Toronto to sign.
Your last roster is intriguing — how many guys could we promote? If we believe Dean, the kids surprised him last year and they’re a bit ahead of schedule. When Kovy was a possibility, he was willing to accelerate the plan (though we’d still be looking to the future with so many prospects that are not quite there yet). But getting those FAs was never guaranteed. So, now we go back to our originally scheduled programming.
I am just fine with bringing up several rookies while we let other prospects continue to develop. That’s just slower. I know we all want it now, and it’s insanely difficult to be patient. But the future’s still looking good for all that. And hurrah for better goaltending.
In Dinglebarn We Trust
Parse
I am expecting Parse to replace Frolovs numbers and could easily see him as LW2. This however makes the 2nd line all right handed. Would rather see Richardsen as LW3 with Zues and Simmonds. Give the 4th line center role to Schenn or Cliche. Preferebly Schenn.
I say no to Willie Mitchell
There is no way he gets healthy and if he does, he’ll just get hurt again. Dude is too old and slow anyway.
I understand the risks with Mitchell
And the Kings’ history with post-bad concussion players is not hopeful. That’s why I would only get him at bargain bin price.
by DougX on Jul 23, 2010 8:38 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Love the Corey Millen reference, Quisp. That guy was one of my favorites to watch back in the 90’s. Dude could fly!!!!
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 8:44 AM PDT reply actions
As far as defensemen go, there are no other top tier talent left in the FA market and trades are drying up. I think Dean will just wait until camp to see what they have and if needed make moves with the teams still at or above the cap to take salary dumps and waiver pickups.
He picked Quincey and Jones the past 2 years, 1 out of 2 isn’t bad. :)
With Murray’s system, you don’t need all star defenseman to have a strong defense and Bernier > Ersberg and possibly > Quick, so goaltending should be better.
Doughty-Scuderi
Muzzin/Hickey/Voynov/??-Johnson
Fransson-Greene
Muzzin (or anyone) can’t really be worse than Jones, can he? Fransson could easily replace O’Donnell and add some puck movement ability to that bottom pair. The O’Donnell-Green pairing was too easy to exploit on the counter attack. Fransson should help get some more foot speed with the bottom pairing.
PK could still be a problem, but it was much better later in the season and Jones wouldn’t be a part of it.
The PP should stronger if Murray keeps Stoll off of the top unit. Doughty-Johnson showed in the playoffs how deadly the Kings PP could be, even without Kovalchuk.
I still think that the LW1 is the biggest need for LA. What about Kariya for a year or 2? Has some good speed and could play well with Kopitar. Smyth is better suited as the LW2 for the Kings with Stoll and Brown.
He picked Quincey
andJones
Dinglebarn picked up the greatest record producer of the 1980’s to play on the blue line for the Kings? Who knew?
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 9:04 AM PDT up reply actions
Kariya would be a good option if he wasn't Kariya.
I just can’t let myself enjoy that option.
I agree re LW1/2. This is where I expect Lombardi to push.
Wait till this year.
Having to cough up a 1st, 2nd and 3rd round pick for what could be just 3 years of Bobby’s services. And it could create some bad blood for other NHL GM’s to give outrageous offer sheers to the Kings RFA’s next season when Meat Train and Doughty are elligible for RFA status…
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 9:07 AM PDT up reply actions
Didn’t happen to Edmonton when they signed Penner, nor has anything happened so far to San Jose when they put an offer out for Hjalmarsson.
The draft picks are steep but possibly worth it. In three years, our prospects will have come to fruition (or not). Hell in three years, there may not be an NHL if Donald Fehr assumes command of the NHLPA. The time for trigger pulling is now, I think.
Well, the reason Chicago didn’t match the offer for Hjalmarsson is obvious; they are shedding salary for cap reasons.
Wait a second…I thought Chicago did end up matching?
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions
Yep, they sure did.
San Jose risked the offer sheet because it was a win-win either way (excellent defensman or furthering a rival’s cap hell), plus Chicago has absolutely no room to hit them back.
It makes sense for some teams, but not necessarily for us. The Kings just have far more valuable RFAs than SJ or Edmonton did if Anaheim wanted to retaliate.
In Dinglebarn We Trust
Has the Oil had any RFA’s worth persuing since they made the mistake with Penner?
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 9:25 AM PDT up reply actions
They'd match?
I don’t see what type of offer LA would throw at Bobby Ryan and not match.
Also,
I also want to bring up the notion of trading for the rights to Bill Sweatt from Toronto
Yes please. We’ll take a conditional 7th.
Tick Tock, Tomas. Tick Tock.
A drinking team with a hockey problem.
by nhlcheapshot on Jul 23, 2010 9:23 AM PDT up reply actions
I just don’t know what is wrong with that dude. He’d have a shot at playing in the NHL for either of the teams that had his rights. I mean, WTF? Do you have any insight on that?
In Dinglebarn We Trust
Bill Sweatt
Maybe Sweatt was afraid that the Leafs were going to put him on a line with Luca Caputti and Joey Crabb which would inevitably end up with their line being called the “C & C Music Factory” line…
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 9:55 AM PDT up reply actions
guaranteed NHL time
based on what i’ve read, Sweatt, a prospect, wanted guaranteed NHL time. of course you wouldnt make that guarantee to a prospect who hasnt proven anything at the NHL level.
he's going to have to sign somewhere
unless he’s a nutcase, i am going to assume that he said that to get the hell out of toronto.
Wait till this year.
And the reason we don’t extend an offer sheet for Bobby Ryan is…?
I believe the most important reason why not is because Dinglebarn & Hextall don’t feel like having a bar stool thrown at their freakin heads.
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions
they'll match. lombardi is opposed on religious grounds. seek trade for ryan...
Wait till this year.
source?
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 10:45 AM PDT up reply actions
http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/hockey/comments/afternoon_line254/
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 11:01 AM PDT up reply actions
Meh
That has “boilerplate” written all over it. Seems to me like an answer similar to “Do I look fat in this dress?”…
Agreed. “I’ll never trade Phaneuf”, traded. “We’re not interested in Kessel”, traded. “I’m retiring”, psych! Oh wait, that last one was football.
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions
“We’re not trading O’Sullivan for Williams!”
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions
But I approve of that move, so it’s okay!
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions
Ryan trade talk is academic. The Ducks won’t trade him within the division, least of all to the Kings.
Well then you’re not welcome in my Ivory Tower anymore, thank you very much.
by JZarris on Jul 23, 2010 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Right, all the more reason we sign him to a ridiculous offer sheet they’re forced to match on principal!!! Oh man, that does get out of hand fast, doesn’t it?
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions
that's a good little agent (pat on head)
but then he needs to sign a contract already.
Wait till this year.
Why is Greene no longer considered a top 4 d-man?
I wholly disagree with the notion that the Kings need a top 4 defenseman. They have a good top 4 already: Doughty-Scuderi and Johnson-Greene. Greene is that stay-at-home guy who can cover for Johnson when he endeavors to make some offense happen.
I’d say the need is someone to play with one of the rookies on the 3rd pairing because at least one rookie defenseman, and probably two, will be skating for the Kings this season. And I don’t think they are starting out in the top 4. You could argue Greene would play with him, but Greene is needed with Johnson for the time being. You can’t put a guy like Kaberle with Johnson because then who is actually playing defense on that defensive pairing?
I think it’s more reasonable to suggest the Kings are looking at a guy like Willie Mitchell to put with Johnson, not a Kaberle type. I think the reasoning behind not calling Greene a top-4 guy is his lack of speed and versatility. He’s a hard hitter but doesn’t move the puck out very well and probably can’t handle 2nd pair minutes over the whole season.
http://www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Jul 23, 2010 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions
Agreed...
…but I think the team needs another defenseman adept at making that first pass out of the zone, and Green is not that guy. Johnson may get there eventually but he is really more of a puck rusher and gets into trouble at times. It certainly seemed that during the Vancouver series, when their forwards were marking and pressuring Doughty continuously, that our D-corps had a very tough time getting clean rush-staring passes to the wings. I think that is why Paul Martin and Hamuis were targeted this off-season.
lineup I'd be happy to see
Hey everyone, new here but have been reading the comments for a while.
I’d like to see Stoll and/or Williams dealt sooner than later if we could bring back the likes of Kaberle involving one of them. I know both get paid too much to bring in Sharp, but he would be a solid addition to at least bring in for this season and see how he fits. He’d be my first pick for the first LW, followed by signing either Poni or Fro if and only if TM played him there, which I know would be highly improbable.
But here’s to dreaming:
Sharp/Ponikarsky/Frolov Kopitar Simmonds
Smyth Schenn Brown
Parse Handzus Richardson
Clifford Modin Westgarth/Clune
Harold
Scuderi Doughty
Johnson Kaberle
Fransson Greene
Quick Bernier
That’s a solid lineup IMO. First line isn’t ideal yet, but Simmonds did have some solid play last year on that line, and with Kopi only getting better, it could work out well enough. What better linemates than Smyth and Brown for Schenn if he were to somehow really bring it and come in as 2nd Center? I really think Smyth would be a perfect mentor for the young center. The third line would be damn solid and could score some goals, and I think bringing Modin in cheap would stabilize what would be a tough, but green line.
That D looks great to me. And of course, Fransson could be replaced by say a Muzzin or a Hickey or Voynov or Martinez, it was just easier to pick one name and save the slashes!
I think the forward lines would be tough to play against and put up solid but not spectacular numbers. But that’s okay if the team matures and something like Quisp’s 2011-12 comes to fruition to bring more offensive power. The improved D and goaltending tandem would ensure this would be a competitive team. Plus JJ and Doughty will probably put up more points this year too.
I wholly approve of saving the slashes -- save the earth!
I don’t know what Bowman is going to do, but I doubt it will be trading Sharp. I included him in my musings because his name is out there, despite Bowman’s protestations. But, if he were actually gettable, we wouldn’t have to give up much roster player-wise.
Kaberle as an option, to me, is not as good as just going with Muzzin. Given that Williams and Stoll are pieces we get to use on some trade. Yeah, Kaberle is tradeable too…so maybe that point doesn’t count. Maybe I just don’t like Kaberle.
That’s a good line-up you’ve got there, I think. I wouldn’t sneeze at it.
Wait till this year.
Hey thanks
I look at this lineup as reflective of the fact that we still need bridge players. Kaberle only has one year left on his contract so I see him as a good fit in that regard.
Honestly, I’d just love to see Smyth with Schenn. He was so good for Kopi, I think it’d be great to utilize his mentor abilities while he’s still around. Modin on the fourth would be another great bridge I think until finally Lewis or Cliche could take over.
Quisp, I’m curious as to why you did not consider Maxim Afinogenov as an option for the Kings. Is it because his reputation for being defensively irresponsible would not make him a fit on a Terry Murray coached team?
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 12:42 PM PDT reply actions
That’s what I suspected. Would you think that Lee Stempniak would be a better or lesser addition to the Kings than Ponikarovsky? Or are those two pretty much interchangeable?
Personally, I would prefer Stempy over Pony.
The Spirit of MeatTrain'10!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 23, 2010 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions
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